Courses for a future in computers.

[Michael Lindsay]

Lately I have been looking into to going to taking some classes to get into Network Administration so I can possibly getting a job doing so. Any ideas on what I should know and what courses to take, I have looked around there's just so many it confuses me. Any help would be appreciated.

[digip]

Lately I have been looking into to going to taking some classes to get into Network Administration so I can possibly getting a job doing so. Any ideas on what I should know and what courses to take, I have looked around there's just so many it confuses me. Any help would be appreciated.

A+, Network+, Server+, Linux+, and CCNA come to mind.

They all touch upon another in smaller peices, but the compTia Network+, Server+ and Linux+ would be the main 3 I would look into for a good networking foundation.

[ret]

whatever you do avoid the cert bootcamp places. They will give you konw knowledge to pass a test however you will not have to tools to work in "real life" Get yourself in contact with the local communite college and take some classes in fundamentals of netowrking and the such. Get a copt of teh Cisco CCNA self study guides and an IOS sim. It may be a good idea to purchase a test lab, or some older cisco equipemnt off of ebay to get practicle experience.

[Darren Kitchen]

There is an awesome bit of software by Cisco that basically lets you build a virtual network by dropping 'em into a document and wiring 'em up like in a Visio document. Then you get to login to each router, bridge, gateway, etc and configure 'em as if they were actual pieces of Cisco equipment. It's really really really right. I've seen it a few times from my Cisco buddies but basically it's only used in CCNA and CC** training right now and not available to the general public right now. I'm wondering if it's found its way to the back channels yet. As a tool for learning networking, addressing, subnetting, firewalls, gateways, VPNs, etc it's a must have tool. Couple that with VMWare and a couple ISOs and you're in business.

Not to say having the physical equipment with all the humming and blinkenlighten isn't fun and all. This coming from the guy whos bedroom used to look like a NOC.

Cheers, good luck with your learning, and yes stay away from those crash-course bootcamp places they're no good.

[Michael Lindsay]

There is an awesome bit of software by Cisco that basically lets you build a virtual network by dropping 'em into a document and wiring 'em up like in a Visio document. Then you get to login to each router, bridge, gateway, etc and configure 'em as if they were actual pieces of Cisco equipment. It's really really really right. I've seen it a few times from my Cisco buddies but basically it's only used in CCNA and CC** training right now and not available to the general public right now. I'm wondering if it's found its way to the back channels yet. As a tool for learning networking, addressing, subnetting, firewalls, gateways, VPNs, etc it's a must have tool. Couple that with VMWare and a couple ISOs and you're in business.

Not to say having the physical equipment with all the humming and blinkenlighten isn't fun and all. This coming from the guy whos bedroom used to look like a NOC.

Cheers, good luck with your learning, and yes stay away from those crash-course bootcamp places they're no good.

By crash-course bootcamp places do you mean places like ITT Tech or ECPI where you only take class's over a 6-12 month period and your done?

[Tenzer]

I have been through the first semester of CCNA, and I don't think it is worth that much. The things you learn from the course can't really be used to that much in real life, as you most likely aren't going to be messing with routers and BGP ie. for the first couple of years.

If you want to work with Cisco equipment is if probably a great starting point, but for common computer/network knowledge I don't find that it's that good.

I don't really have any other suggestions as I haven't done other courses yet (I might be on my way to get a Solaris Administrator course through work :)), but to my experience nothing beats working with the equipment in a real life scenario for at company. It also makes much more sense then.

[digip]

I have been through the first semester of CCNA, and I don't think it is worth that much. The things you learn from the course can't really be used to that much in real life, as you most likely aren't going to be messing with routers and BGP ie. for the first couple of years.

If you want to work with Cisco equipment is if probably a great starting point, but for common computer/network knowledge I don't find that it's that good.

I don't really have any other suggestions as I haven't done other courses yet (I might be on my way to get a Solaris Administrator course through work :)), but to my experience nothing beats working with the equipment in a real life scenario for at company. It also makes much more sense then.

CCNA techs start at 60,000 a year in most states. Not worrth it? I think it depends on what you are doing. CCNA people are one of the highest regarded people in IT and one of the most needed in big organizations. It's not just networking, but a role in itself and is not an easy skill to master. The basics may be low level and easy to pick up without a CCNA course, but the later more advanced stuff is where the skill set comes in to play. I see jobs all the time starting from $30 to $60/hr to start for CCNA people(Depending on yoru role and skill set), so even if you find it easy(which I don't think it is), it may be easy money for someone like you who has a good handle on it, why not have that skill added to your resume!

[Darren Kitchen]

Yeah dude don't dismiss the fundamentals or high level stuff you won't see in the real world right away. When you finally do run into it you'll thank your lucky stars you have at least a basic understanding of the stuff, even if you don't remember it all the concepts will stick and you'll know where to find answers.

[digip]

If I had the money and time to do things over again in life, I woudl probably have gone back to get a CS degree and study all of the above as well as C+, Java, PHP, Ajax, MCSE, CISP and CEH, Security, and all the Cisco offerings. I missed the chance when I got out of high school, none of this stuff was even brought to our attention nor did I even know it existed. I was taking courses for CAD and Architecture, and lost interest in school. Had there been the internet and computers in my life back then, my world would be a much different place.

If you have the opportunity to take ANY computer related classes, take them. Devote all your school time to it as much as you can, because once you get a job, get married, have kids, it makes it ten fold harder to accomplish any of it in your spare time!! Trust me, you will regret any missed chances you had while you are young or just in a place in life where you have the chance to go to school for something you love doing. Jobs suck and there aren't any good paying jobs these days that don't require some sort of computer skill set on some level, so absorb anything you can get your hands on!! Trust your technolust is not just a saying, it's a mean to an ends!

[wetelectric]

If it's possible, get a university degree (i know you have to be pretty well off in the States to get one). Work in a start up. Learn the proper way.. then specialise. This is when you take a night course to get those other bits of papers. Bits of paper with no experience equals very expensive toilet paper.

[SmoothCriminal]

Like it was said earlier, get a university degree if you can. Certifications are great, but businesses like a university degree, it shows them you have the ability to learn, and although you may not have experience with their systems, they can mold you how they see fit. If you go the cert route, definitely check out CCNA, A+, MCSE, and take a course in object oriented programming. This will qualify you for entry level positions of network engineering or systems technicians. Oh, and if you do go the Certification route, don't think of it as a test you have to pass, think of it as material you have to learn to be better at your job. I would avoid places like ITT tech if I were you. Chances are if you see the school on a commercial you should avoid it.

[Michael Lindsay]

Ok, I signed up for a 12 week A+ Certification class so I have something to keep me occupied until I can get the money for the classes I want to take at TCC. The place I'm taking the A+ Certification class at also offer's a Network + Certification class. The details on the paper didn't really explain to me what a Network + Certification was so could someone tell me if it's worth signing up for or should I just wait and take the Network classes at TCC (Community College)?

[digip]

Ok, I signed up for a 12 week A+ Certification class so I have something to keep me occupied until I can get the money for the classes I want to take at TCC. The place I'm taking the A+ Certification class at also offer's a Network + Certification class. The details on the paper didn't really explain to me what a Network + Certification was so could someone tell me if it's worth signing up for or should I just wait and take the Network classes at TCC (Community College)?

If you are going to be taking courses at the college, then it's up to you if you want to do them twice, but the more hands on, the better. Just depends on the money and time you have to invest in it. I personally would do the college route for the networking side, as you will probably get more hands on, plus access to their labs to play with things. Even a cert in Networking is good to have, but just make sure you get the hands on and can tinker with things, learn to trouble shoot problems, etc.

[ret]

Ok, I signed up for a 12 week A+ Certification class so I have something to keep me occupied until I can get the money for the classes I want to take at TCC. The place I'm taking the A+ Certification class at also offer's a Network + Certification class. The details on the paper didn't really explain to me what a Network + Certification was so could someone tell me if it's worth signing up for or should I just wait and take the Network classes at TCC (Community College)?

TCC (Tidewater Community College??) I assume you are in hampton roads. If you can i strongly suggest looking @ ODU. Might want to do your first 2 years @ TCC to save $$. ODU has a great CS dept and they work with NAVSTANORVA a lot. You could easily slip into the shipyard or civil service if you make the right connections. Professor Herbert Ketchum is pretty awesome.

[metatron]

Go get a computer science degree and then work a low level job at an ISP for a few years to learn your shit. Than you can work nearly anyway, in relation to sysadmin work.

[Swathe]

Go get a computer science degree and then work a low level job at an ISP for a few years to learn your shit. Than you can work nearly anyway, in relation to sysadmin work.

QFT.

[jtcgreyfox]

Whats a good way to go about looking for work as a network admin or similar?

I'm currently doing a computer engineering degree in Australia, but i'm paranoid that it wont be THAT useful, because its mostly theory, and whenever i see job offers, they all do the "must have minimum 2 years experience in the field" slapped on the front.

The same goes for the game industry. And the advice I was given for that was "start out as QA and work you're way up". But if you start as QA you can't really progress can you?

I guess what i'm asking is, how can you get you're foot in the door for networking?

[Swathe]

i'm about to start ccna,ccnp,msce and linux certs through work.

[Deveant]

There is an awesome bit of software by Cisco that basically lets you build a virtual network by dropping 'em into a document and wiring 'em up like in a Visio document. Then you get to login to each router, bridge, gateway, etc and configure 'em as if they were actual pieces of Cisco equipment. It's really really really right. I've seen it a few times from my Cisco buddies but basically it's only used in CCNA and CC** training right now and not available to the general public right now. I'm wondering if it's found its way to the back channels yet. As a tool for learning networking, addressing, subnetting, firewalls, gateways, VPNs, etc it's a must have tool. Couple that with VMWare and a couple ISOs and you're in business.

Darren, you may just wanna do a lil searching for PacketTracer 5, its only released via Netacad (cisco's online traning) but it can be found through others means...

sadly it doesnt handle advansed commands so well, but there more found in CCNP, more things on the lines of OSPF and IS-IS.

[AeroZeppelin]

I have a chance to be in a cert program for a security training for security+ and other infosec items. Does this sound like a worthwhile venture?

[fitzy]

Your better off with a degree in CS, than getting a cert. The problem is the market has been flooded with certs, so with out a degree they become almost worthless.

[Swathe]

Your better off with a degree in CS, than getting a cert. The problem is the market has been flooded with certs, so with out a degree they become almost worthless.

Depends on location. In my corner of Australia certs will win over a degree 99% of the time due to the more hands on practical experiance certs give.

[kickarse]

Anyone that is a CCNA, DB administrator (oracle, sql, postresgl, etc), security auditor is good in my book.

[Deveant]

Depends on location. In my corner of Australia certs will win over a degree 99% of the time due to the more hands on practical experiance certs give.

Disagreed. Ive got 3 more weeks in my Adv.Dip in System Engineering, its given my my CCNA, CCNP, A+, MSCE, and a couple of other shit bits of paper, but i still require and University degree before anyone will even look at paying me over 52k.

Also when it comes to Computer related courses at Uni's, there is a lot of Practical, its just a myth that theirs not. If all goes well ill being working towards a Bach of CS majoring in Network Programming, 2/4 of my classes are practicals, 1/4 Lectures, and 1/4 discussion groups. I think they said its about 25h's a week behind a computer on campus, then about another 20h's a week at home doing assignments.

[Swathe]

Disagreed. Ive got 3 more weeks in my Adv.Dip in System Engineering, its given my my CCNA, CCNP, A+, MSCE, and a couple of other shit bits of paper, but i still require and University degree before anyone will even look at paying me over 52k.

Also when it comes to Computer related courses at Uni's, there is a lot of Practical, its just a myth that theirs not. If all goes well ill being working towards a Bach of CS majoring in Network Programming, 2/4 of my classes are practicals, 1/4 Lectures, and 1/4 discussion groups. I think they said its about 25h's a week behind a computer on campus, then about another 20h's a week at home doing assignments.

I'm only repeating what employers have told me and i get over 52k with no certs or degree just practical experience.