Cops raiding lanparty's(one today) *update*

[DLSS]

can you imagine?

nate_lapt: See this fucker BOOM HEADSHOT

RIAA goons: "file trading has been linked to terrorism..."

LAN party murder:

http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/view.php?Stor...18-020542-5266r

damn hats fucked up aswell , dude ur 16 and kill a 11 year old? for taunting u ?

come on get real. to both losing from a 11 year old and for killing him UR A NOOB ! , if u cant handle taunts or losing dont play the games !

but back on topic :

cooper once again thnx for translating :P ure gr8 m8 :D

[Sparda]

So errrrmm... now they are raiding LAN parties, are they going to start raiding garden parties for serving food with out a health license?

[Digital Arcanist]

I don't think it would be for serviing food without a license but more for the trading of illegal foods or foods procurred illegally. :?

Drop the h'ourderve grandma and put your hands in the air!!!!! We are confiscating these crab cakes and cucumber sandwiches ladies!!!!

[Faith +1]

It won't happen in the US....not until they start putting chips in our heads to track us.

Not without a proper search warrant will they get through the door.

You say they have guns, I do too. It is my right as an american to not allow illegal search and seizure, and my right to bear arms... lots of arms :-)

If these guys were advertising free access to lots of files, thats just retarded.

Most of the "Lan Parties" I go to are also for the games, not for file sharing.

[Digital Arcanist]

I think you missed the point Faith.....if they are putting chips in our heads that pretty much means we have no civil rights so warrants wouldn't exactly stop cops anymore.

Illegal search or not, you can never point a gun or brandish a weapon to an officer of the law.

[cooper]

Not without a proper search warrant will they get through the door.

Who says they didn't have one? Plus, they might've even let them in. Or perhaps even the people who own the place they held the party in allowed it. Or they signed some contract that would make this a possibility.

Spouting about guns and what have you is the redneck cowboy mentality most europeans hate about the US. We don't have a right to bear arms (in fact, we have laws against it) and I personally feel a whole lot safer because of it.

[DLSS]

Not without a proper search warrant will they get through the door.

Who says they didn't have one? Plus, they might've even let them in. Or perhaps even the people who own the place they held the party in allowed it. Or they signed some contract that would make this a possibility.

Spouting about guns and what have you is the redneck cowboy mentality most europeans hate about the US. We don't have a right to bear arms (in fact, we have laws against it) and I personally feel a whole lot safer because of it.

exactly ....

, and they did have a search warrent .....

[Faith +1]

I think you missed the point Faith.....if they are putting chips in our heads that pretty much means we have no civil rights so warrants wouldn't exactly stop cops anymore.

Illegal search or not, you can never point a gun or brandish a weapon to an officer of the law.

If they are on my property illegally you're incorrect about me showing them that I am armed (Pointing it directly at them wouldnt be smart, but showing them that I am armed is different). That would be my Second and Fourth Amendments of the Constitution of the United States of America.

If someone has proper papers to come into my home to search for something so be it. But I ,for one, am not stupid enough to disclose to all participants that something illegal would be going on there. Sounds like a recipe for disaster anyways.

Your opinion of me stating I have arms is the "Redneck Cowboy Mentality most Europeans hate about the US." is your opinion. You are very much entitled to it. Thats the differences in Government / Culture. I have my reasons (Wont bore you with the details) but I own guns, and I also feel safe.

DA - if someone wants to put this chip in my head they wont get me without a fight. That was the point I was making to you, which you missed.

[Digital Arcanist]

You must be slow or something Faith...I wrote and you quoted that regardless of an illegal search you can't point a gun at or brandish a melee type weapon at a law enforcement officer.

I don't think you understand what illegal search and seizure means. An officer can walk around you property and enter your home if the door is open. He can not however use anything he finds in enclosed areas such as cupboards, boxes, etcetera as evidence against you in a criminal case. The point of the amendment is to protect the people from officers using false pretense to satisfy curiosity or unfounded suspsicion.

As for strutting around like some prize cock with your gun.....well, you take the safety of yourself and your family in your own hands. Officers of your local law enforcement agency have some tight restrictions regarding the use of their firearms but federal agents don't really and with the Patriot Act and other Home Lan security programs things are even looser in some areas.

Only a few states in our union have self-defense laws that will leave you with any legal recourse in criminal matters should you use deadly force. Instead of toting around your guns, you should try non-lethal forms of protection.

As for going down with a fight.....talk is cheap!

[Faith +1]

You must be slow or something Faith...I wrote and you quoted that regardless of an illegal search you can't point a gun at or brandish a melee type weapon at a law enforcement officer.

I guess you didnt understand my post "showing them Im armed" (the police) is not a crime where I live. Pointing the gun directly at them is. I am allowed to walk my streets with a fully loaded weapon without recourse. I know it varies from state, but show me the law in Arizona that says to have a gun on your side, or over your shoulder without being "thrown in jail?" Now I didnt say I would "Brandish" the weapon, I would show that I was armed meaning It would be already displayed, in a holster or or even over my shoulder with a strap. If I had a concealed weapons permit I would only have to tell the officer if they ask.

I don't think you understand what illegal search and seizure means. An officer can walk around you property and enter your home if the door is open. He can not however use anything he finds in enclosed areas such as cupboards, boxes, etcetera as evidence against you in a criminal case. The point of the amendment is to protect the people from officers using false pretense to satisfy curiosity or unfounded suspsicion.

I do. You can not enter private property without proper documentation stating you may enter (Aka Warrant) with or without the owners permission(e.g. rentals or apartments). I do however realize that with the "Probable" cause clause if there is something that catches the eye of the officer they may enter. All officers are told not to enter property unless there is the probable cause because otherwise all evidence as you stated would be "Thrown" out, and the prosecutor would have that officer guarding a shack out in the middle of nowhere.

Technically if they see something in plain sight prior to entering which gives them probable cause then they are just to search the property.

As for strutting around like some prize cock with your gun.....well, you take the safety of yourself and your family in your own hands. Officers of your local law enforcement agency have some tight restrictions regarding the use of their firearms but federal agents don't really and with the Patriot Act and other Home Lan security programs things are even looser in some areas.

Who said I was strutting around? I have done nothing more than made a few statements to attest facts. Of anything your over reacting to my statement.

Its a matter of principle that if you do have a weapon that you not show it unless you are in imminent danger of being killed by someone else because its a tactical advantage for them to not know you have a gun. Not to mention the proper care and safeguarding of that weapon is something I dont joke about nor take chances with. So please explain to me how I am taking the safety of myself or my family in my own hands?

Could you please point out the portions outlining Homeland security and the portions of the Patriot act that states the Federal Government officers have less of a restriction than the local government? From what I can ascertain, that unless you are a part of an operation (not just agents) you can not do anything more or less than the local police department where every bullet is accounted for and internal investigations are held / agents potentially placed on administrative leave depending on the situation.

Only a few states in our union have self-defense laws that will leave you with any legal recourse in criminal matters should you use deadly force. Instead of toting around your guns, you should try non-lethal forms of protection.

Arizona is one of those states. So I guess you should have been asking what state I resided in rather than assuming the later. I would have to say for any gun owner to resort to use of their gun they better be damn sure that there is no other way out because anyone who has gone through the concealed weapons permitting program knows that there are about 98% of situations where you cant use your gun, but the 1-2% (or even less) that you may use it is worth it if you value your life. It requires a lot of patience with people and a basic understanding of tactics.

As for going down with a fight.....talk is cheap!

Well I guess youll have to take my word for it now wont you?

Somewhat back on topic - I never stated that these guys should use weapons to keep their lan party serene. I actually stated what they did was dumb, disclosing illegal activities that were to be held there. Why would anyone in their right mind go to a widely publicized event in which your computer could be confiscated?

All I was trying to convey was that I have the ability to display a gun in public where I live, and I also have the ability to own guns from where I live. If you dont agree with it so be it, but dont try to tell me what I am doing is illegal or unsafe when you dont know the facts.

[Digital Arcanist]

Arizona Criminal Code 13-3102 says that you can not walk the streets with a gun as you so brazenly profess. In fact, unless you are in an unpopulated (an area with no municipal services) area or conscripted into tempory service by either the National Guard, Military or local law agency, you can not open;y carry a firearm.

As for an officer having the right to enter into property (ie. walk around your yard, look into your windows, walk into your home through an open door, not mistaken for unlocked but actually physically open) they are within their rights as peace officers to do so.

A search warrant is used only when a physical object is to be removed from the person or home/office/warehouse etc. Such physical items are admissible in Arizona courts as evidence in criminal matters. The use of eavesdropping equipment is not covered in a search warrant. The definition and methods of procurring a search warrant are outlined in Title 13 Article 8 of your state's codes.

Different passges of Title 13 legislature also indicate that a peace officer has the ability to move freely among any structure in a community as long as he can justify his actions as in the best interests of said community. If his actions are found to be unjustified then it is known as a Error of Good Faith and as far as I can tell is pretty much a slap on the wrist for the officer.

I'm done "debating" with you. I have my facts. Your initial post and its rebuttal has derailed the purpose of the thread. Before your post I believe we were discussing the probability of a similar raid happening in the US. I also believe the general concensus was that what happened sucks but will not happen in the US at least for some time.

It was a great article and a good cautionary tail. :D It's also nice to have multi-lingual members to translate for us. I can handle the Spanish and Latin articles but I have no clue about the Germanic languages, with the exception of English of course.

[Faith +1]

Arizona Criminal Code 13-3102 says that you can not walk the streets with a gun as you so brazenly profess. In fact, unless you are in an unpopulated (an area with no municipal services) area or conscripted into tempory service by either the National Guard, Military or local law agency, you can not open;y carry a firearm.

You should have read the part about carrying the weapon out in public - F. Subsection A, paragraph 1 about being in plain sight. Not to mention I dont go carrying this around on the base or any area thats being utilized by the US Military; I can however carry it in public as long as no laws prohibit them - e.g. School, Government Buildings.

As for an officer having the right to enter into property (ie. walk around your yard, look into your windows, walk into your home through an open door, not mistaken for unlocked but actually physically open) they are within their rights as peace officers to do so.

Within their rights? Not unless there is just probable cause. Otherwise they are outside of their rights and unlawful. Again which is why most officers dont do it unless authorized by someone else.

A search warrant is used only when a physical object is to be removed from the person or home/office/warehouse etc. Such physical items are admissible in Arizona courts as evidence in criminal matters. The use of eavesdropping equipment is not covered in a search warrant. The definition and methods of procurring a search warrant are outlined in Title 13 Article 8 of your state's codes.

In this specific instance we are talking about would there not be computers with "illegal" files on them being shared "illegally?" Therefore a warrant in this case is easy to attain.

Different passges of Title 13 legislature also indicate that a peace officer has the ability to move freely among any structure in a community as long as he can justify his actions as in the best interests of said community. If his actions are found to be unjustified then it is known as a Error of Good Faith and as far as I can tell is pretty much a slap on the wrist for the officer.

Again we are talking - "Probable Cause" to justify their actions. What other means can they justify them?

I'm done "debating" with you. I have my facts. Your initial post and its rebuttal has derailed the purpose of the thread. Before your post I believe we were discussing the probability of a similar raid happening in the US. I also believe the general concensus was that what happened sucks but will not happen in the US at least for some time.

You do not have all facts, you completely skipped over the information I requested about the Patriot Act and the division of homeland security. Not to mention you are only posting half truths about articles in Arizona. If you are done so be it but dont say something unless you are prepared for a rebuttal.

It was a great article and a good cautionary tail. Very Happy It's also nice to have multi-lingual members to translate for us. I can handle the Spanish and Latin articles but I have no clue about the Germanic languages, with the exception of English of course.

I also agree on this statement. Dont advertise a LAN party and say something illegal is going to occur without knowing the authorities are going to come a knocking. How bout just do the LAN parties to play games :-).

[VaKo]

Just a question:

To those of you who own guns, how many of you have actually used them to kill or maim another human?

And why?

If you haven't, what would be enough to make you take a life?

And could you look another person in the eyes and unload a round into there chest?

[Sparda]

Depends on whats happening, I would not kill (out of choice) for greed or to get some thing I wanted. I may consider, how ever, killing to save my life or lives of others depending on the saveraty of the situation.

[DLSS]

this is going sooooooooo off topic :roll: :cry:

[VaKo]

this is going sooooooooo off topic :roll: :cry:

You must be new to the internet... ;-)

[Faith +1]

Just a question:

To those of you who own guns, how many of you have actually used them to kill or maim another human?

And why?

If you haven't, what would be enough to make you take a life?

And could you look another person in the eyes and unload a round into there chest?

I apologize there is no way for me to try to pretend Im keeping this on topic as Digital Arcanist and I have sort of tried doing.

Used my guns to kill or main another human - never. How many times do I want to use it in that circumstance never if I can help it.

Why - because as DA was pointing out in a lot of US States you can not use deadly force as a last resort no matter what. In Arizona you may if you are in imminent danger of someone unlawfully using deadly force against you. But I caution you, that doesnt mean that just because you pull a gun out at me I can shoot you dead to rights. I have to know that your intent is to kill me with that weapon and or another weapon in which I may lawfully stop your unlawful behavior of trying to kill me. Hopefully you could follow that.

What would make me take someones life? The idea of Kill or be killed comes to mind. Thats it, not out of a fit or rage or some other emotion except self preservation for myself or my family.

Guns require respect. A lot more than most people give them. To understand the tool, you must first treat it with respect for the power within without abusing and or using that power incorrectly.

Lastly - can I look someone in the eye and unload a round? Tough one. I guess the answer I have is - If necessary I hope so.

[VaKo]

Nice inteligent reply, much respect. But again, out of interest, do you need any firearms training to carry conceled weapons in Arizona?

Personally, if it comes down to it, I have no idea if I could or not. Just never been in a situation that could warrent the use of deadly force.

<btw, to make it clear, I love guns, I just wish there was an IQ/morality/emotional stability test to own one.>

[Faith +1]

out of interest, do you need any firearms training to carry conceled weapons in Arizona?

Yes. There is a concealed weapons permitting class that you must go through in order to attain the permit. You dont even have to be an AZ resident to get it, because a lot of states allow the concealed weapons permit from AZ to be valid in their state due to a reciprocation agreement. Within this course you must have firearms training.

[DLSS]

this is going sooooooooo off topic :roll: :cry:

You must be new to the internet... ;-)

nah i'm used to the internet but on most forums im on u got some moderators that keep it under control u know , deleting posts , warning and if nothing can save the topic , they lock it ..... :?

[VaKo]

But in this case the off-topic talk was actually more interesting than the subject (IMHO, sorry... but i think those kids weren't hush-hush enough).

[calderbankw]

Here in the U.K kids have got arrested for playing with cap guns and water pistals that look like hand guns. If anyone walked down the center of town with even a bb gun there would proberly be a squad of arm police officers on them with in 10 minutes.

Back to the topic if you were plaining to share files you wouldnt advertise it to the whole town. If you did you can expect something like this to happen.

[DLSS]

ok tomorrow i'm going to L4C (lan for charity)

http://www.lan4charity.be/

first lan i'm going to since that bust ....

being verry paranoid hopeing they dont bust in there ....

its a lot larger then the one they busted (that one was 30 ppl this one's 300 ppl)

and it is for charity so most ppl are pretty sure they wont fall in ....

i really hope they wont aqswell cos i'll take my new machine (+ €2000 machine) and i swear if they dear take that no matter cop or not i'll keep kicking his ass until i cant kick no more .....

anyway hope 4 the best ...

[cooper]

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

Put all the evil stuff in a dedicated folder, and have a batch script standing by that will nuke everything in that folder should a bust be taking place.

Might cost you your files, but it's better than the alternative.

[melodic]

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

Put all the evil stuff in a dedicated folder, and have a batch script standing by that will nuke everything in that folder should a bust be taking place.

Might cost you your files, but it's better than the alternative.

windows script or nix?