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Rule Britannia


cabster21
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Due to what's going on right now, and it seems America is against us. Or rather the USA won't back us, and SA seem to be joining forces this time. The Great British people living on the Falklands are possibly getting worried. I thought I would start a thread if anyone had anything to say.

My thoughts? The people living there are British, they want to be British. My father fought last time, and I plan to sign up. I noramlly shrug these things off, but watching this... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scdEyn1QL2c

No one is our ally it seems, last time the French supported them secretly by supplying them with much needed weapons, but I for one would support this war. The states will no doubt supply us with needed intel, but I feel their reasoning is poor. Most of your country is Latino, so you don't want to upset them, fine.

To all the Great British people. C'MON!!

I can post this as I have a bad enough reputation on here. So this isn't to offend anyone. It also angers we that's we're in Afghanistan purely because the States asked NATO to, well fat lot that means eh? Now I'm not saying we need them. But unlike last time when Reagan supported us, which gave us a lift and let us know if we needed it, they were there. Now there is no public support.

This is a rant thread so I think it should stay and people add what they want, even if it is to slag me off to dirt. And by all means, Americans and... Yes... Okay Argies but let it be known I love the world but dislike the French and Indians, but fucking hate you Argie bastards. I do not represent the UK, I'm an idiot so I will cry as it is my party.

When Britain first, at heaven's command,

Aro-o-o-ose from out the a-a-a-zure main,

Arose, arose, arose from out the a-azure main,

This was the charter, the charter of the land,

And guardian A-a-angels sang this strain:

Rule Britannia!

Britannia rule the waves

Britons never, never, never shall be slaves.

Rule Britannia!

Britannia rule the waves.

Britons never, never, never shall be slaves.

The nations, no-o-o-o-ot so blest as thee,

Must i-i-i-i-in their turn, to ty-y--yrants fall,

Must in, must in, must in their turn, to ty-y-rants fall,

While thou shalt flourish, shalt flourish great and free,

The dread and e-e-e-e-nvy of them all.

Rule Britannia!

Britannia rule the waves.

Britons never, never, never shall be slaves.

Rule Britannia!

Britannia rule the waves.

Britons never, never, never shall be slaves

Fellow Americans, I should point out, I love being your allies and I know you do a lot behind the scenes. So I don't need to hear how we would be speaking German without you. I just think this time Obama - (is this fucker Spanish? should be public with the support.

I'm also going to apologise this time, as I don't mean to offend most people on these forums. So like said, this isn't the UK, it's just one man.

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I seem to have missed your point?

Are you for/against another Falklands war? Or for/against Britain ruling foreign territory (remnants of our empire)?

What?

"Britain ruling foreign territory" Can you explain where I said this?

And yes I am for us defending our country. Okay right now I have to live in Dundee and this is a place that could be let go. If I could switch the two then yes. This is a place that should not be defended.

sorry posted the above comment before I saw you state your location as Dundee.

You know that the people there are British, do you think they should just be kicked out? Can you imagine if they were shipped to the likes of Dundee? Yeah the overgate is great and they have ev... No wait.

Your opinion is very valid though, and I find it very interesting. I'm going to guess you're very young and being from an area like Dundee you're too far from Leuchars to have a mil pull. But it counts in this day and age, thanks.

Again, sorry if I snapped. But this is my country and I have ties to it. My father is HSO in the MOD so I take a larger interest in this so will defend it as I see fit. But please continue with your thoughts. But if mine were not clear enought with such comments as "but I for one would support this war" Or that we as Britain officially see the Falklands as ours. Then I wish to make this point clear.

Edited by cabster21
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Its a fucking shit-hole island on the far side of the planet we own because we nicked it off of Argentina after 500 years of various powers "owning it". The only reason we want it now is because of the oil, not because of the people or any of the bullshit nationalistic arguments you spout.

Why can't you be honest with yourself and say "if it wasn't for the oil, I wouldn't give a fuck". Because if you do, we can start discussing how many lives its worth, and then factor those lives into terms like "how many miles can I drive per life?".

The intelligent thing to do would be to push Argentina to work with us to co-develop the oil fields and then we can both profit from the resources there without any loss of life. Or we could sell it all. We could do with the cash, we certainly can't afford to fight for it.

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The intelligent thing to do is not to have Britain. We can't exist on our own. Thankfully people such as myself will never have anything to do with the running of the country, I will simply be there to fight and die for it. Thankfully people like you aren't either.

When you realise the world is all the same. We then choose where we want to reside. Vako is nothing British, your parents raped the country. There was something for them back then, you're left here you will move on. I will die.

From this thread we have one, myself the Brit. The realist DarkBlueBox and the rider Vako. It is events like this that change the world. Think about this, we all pick sides? Do you not think it's interesting? We have one true superpower i.e. America. But they can't do anything without the Hispanic nation backing them. No one will use nuclear. The likes of Vako will go where they get the better lifestyle. DarkBlueBox will go where he is best suited. This is what our ancestors did. Me? I will probably die first and never be remembered. History is fascinating.

I forgot to say, it had been offered that the best thing to do would be to work together for the oil. Of course I don't care about oil. My government? They don't care about me, but hey. I'm British. You are not, I know this because you say it is a shit hole. So is the place you live in. I don't mind if you feel it is stupid. Please give your feelings.

If you hadn't guessed I'm doing some research. Something got me though, Sparda. I saw you looking at the thread but no answer. I could make assumptions but your name is too vague. I don't know anything about Vako, he is just someone on the net with poor grammar that leads me to believe he was educated in the UK, but doesn't have ties here. Obviously his name is an indication as well. You didn't post so I bring your name up. If you think what I've brought up is just rubbish and don't want to reply fine, likewise if you don't want to post anything for whatever reason that is fair enough. Your silence doesn't mean anything.

All I'm asking is people put their true feelings into this.

What angers you? Is it patriotic people? Is it the average brit i.e. the beer drinking football fan. Or whatever it may be.

The fact here so far is that the two people living in the UK don't agree with it and don't understand it.

The wars fought thankfully haven't affected many people in the UK, and really they don't care.

Look at America. They feel they can't be touched, wha about the people in the towers? Is it we just don't care unless it's us?

Please post, make a fake name if you like or PM me.

Edited by cabster21
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The intelligent thing to do would be to push Argentina to work with us to co-develop the oil fields and then we can both profit from the resources there without any loss of life. Or we could sell it all. We could do with the cash, we certainly can't afford to fight for it.

I agree with you VaKo, a diplomatic solution is the way forward in this situation.

War doesn't really solve anything, cause at the end of it, all you have is a load of destroyed equipment and dead soldiers but the dispute will still remain.

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I agree with you VaKo, a diplomatic solution is the way forward in this situation.

War doesn't really solve anything, cause at the end of it, all you have is a load of destroyed equipment and dead soldiers but the dispute will still remain.

But this is it, what is the solution? Britain give it up and the people living there move here? Or Argentina take control and...

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The solution is that we work together, and we both gain substantial independent energy resources. Or we sell it and put the money back into infrastructure projects (especially in the north of the UK), education and welfare reform. Either one of these options are sorely needed, as the banking crisis has left us in a precarious position both economically and in geo-political terms. War would further weaken our position, as it would gain little international support and our military is already over-committed in the middle-east. Simply put, we are currently unable to sustain the necessary force projection deployment required to fight, especially in a situation where Argentina gains military support from other nations and we do not. It is unlikely we would gain any support from the Americans or EU.

It is interesting that your first port of call in this debate is to cast aspersions on my nationality, I am indeed British, I was born in Hampshire (and currently reside in Hampshire), despite having a very mixed ethnic heritage I do consider myself to be a British European. As for where I live? Yes, it is pretty dire. Simply because there has been a lack of proper investment in our future and we are paying the price, as is much of the UK. We need to be pragmatic, the empire is gone, we are a small country with a lack of resources and we lack the means to go it alone any longer. Our former overseas interests are rapidly emerging from the developing world and while all is not lost yet, many are better placed to take on the 21st century than we are. The Americans have there own problems and interests now, so despite our reluctance we need to take our place in the EU more seriously. In geo-political terms this is where our future path resides.

What angers me in this case is not your patriotism, it is simply your failure to accept the reality of our situation, and instead place your hopes on a war which will do us no favors. We are not a world power, and have not been for some time. Our influence is waning, and our nation is crumbling. We need to focus on goals that will serve us into the 22nd century, we need to use what is left of our heritage and focus on educating our population to be a competent, skilled 21st century workforce and provide them with the infrastructure required to flourish. We need to accept the new world order that is rapidly emerging and focus on exploiting our remaining influence to take advantage of this. Look at the Americans and 9/11, they never saw it coming and are now having pay the price for this.

The Falklands are a resource, nothing more, nothing less. We need to work out the best way to extract value from this and use the resources it can offer us to resolve the multitude of issues we are currently facing. If we opt to waste this in a war we will not do well from, even if we win, then we are fools.

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Yay one political thread I didn't start :). As for the issue I say the US needs to stay out of it, we tried to help Iraq (look what happened, everyone hates us for doing that), stay out of other nations issues (well I guess this is a little bit more of an issue sense Britain is out ally), it still seems that Argentina wants it for the oil and the only reason Britain won't give it back is for the oil, so go Britain (sense well I think we would be better of with an ally having it than Argentina) :)

As for oil, we need to find an alternative (no not for the environmentalists!) and no not because we are running out of oil but to remove an future dependency on oil (we get most of ours from Cananda of all places).

Edited by Zimmer
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That's bullshit. Cut him down!

Fight or don't fight. But Jesus fuck don't fight to go from British rule to Argentinean rule hahaha. Independence (you can't defend your self from SA though. They see that oil and those boys get tough!) The simple fact is if Britain was not there SA would whoop your ass. USA wouldn't give two shits if it were and independent country.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/...71208150135.htm

Britain just ordered two new diesel aircraft carriers they'll be ready to whoop some ass and spend what they've got left.

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I for one don't understand your whole tactic to bring the US into the mix and try to somehow justify it by saying you backed us in Afghanistan. You had just as much reason ot be there than we did. Its Iraq that you should have stayed out of and not gotten involved with, nor should we have.

We should have never left Afghanistan in the first place, which is where we were chasing down Osama Bin Laden because of 9/11. Now, the fact that Britain is with us in Afghanistan is not just because we asked (which is why you were in Iraq, not Afghanistan), but from what I remember, you were also under attack from terrorists for helping us in Iraq as well, which originated from the Pakistan and Afghanistan region of terrorist cells. You were also targeted in the UK as I recall, maybe not as broad a hit as 9/11, but 1 death from a terroristic act is enough to act on as far as I am concerned. Let me ask you this, forget about Afghanistan for a moment, but were you for or against going to Iraq? To start, I for one, never wanted us to go to Iraq in the first place, yet Bush, Cheny and Congress lead us down that road to a war with a country that never attacked us in the first place (in regard to 9/11). More than anything, it was to take control of the oil after knocking out Saddam, knowing they had something to gain afterwards if things didnt work out, we had another asset to offset the failure.

Had we stuck to dismantling Al Qaeda, the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden to begin with, things might be a lot different today as far as international ties, but dragging us into a non issue of land dispute in the Falklands that has nothing to do with a war we're involved in, shit, were not going to just jump at that opportunity. We are stretched a bit thin as it is, and there are more ways to handle Chavez than going to war with him. He's not a threat to anyone. Chavez isn't attacking us or Britain in a terroristic manner such as Al Qaeda did. Insulting your Queen is not enough to start a war. Our own people insult Bush and Obama, its not enough to have a civil war over choosing sides, Republican vs Democrat.

Obama for one at least has some sense to keep us out of shit we don't belong in, but he inherited Iraq and Afghanistan from Bush, so while I don't want us there, I support our men and women on the ground on the mere fact they didn't have a choice in going there. They were ordered into this mess, and I don't just support our U.S. troops, I support all the countries, men and women who have fought there and died for this bullshit war that should never have been in the first place, where nothing good has come from it. This is a senseless war to begin with, and now you want to start another one with this idiot Chavez over what? Land their people owned to begin with, but because some other country came in and claimed it as their own territory, its somehow worth killing over? No good will come of it and you will solve noithing in the process. Unless he is slautering people and attacking your country, its people, why would any other country get involved?

This is the same tired repetitive bullshit that has been happening for centuries, and until we realize that we can't just go around taking shit and forcing people out of their land, we will never have any kind of peace. Been going on in the middle east longer than any of us have been here and look at the mess they have to deal with. Where is the forward looking view, a positive future for the next generations to come? Why put the burden on them when we can work to fix things now? Going to war only sets them up for inheriting that mess. You are a perfect example, your fathers generation of involvment, now your idea to back that mess as the next generation of mistake makers.

If diplomacy fails, and Chavez starts attacking Britains, USA, etc, then hell yeah, I would be one to say someone needs to help them, put a stop to the bullshit, but everything Chavez says is arrogant and instigative to begin with. He does the same thing with the USA all the time, and was one of the biggest bashers of the Bush administration, something Chavez at least got right in my mind. I didn't care much for Bush and his politics, and Bush is most of the reason my country's economy is in the shitter today, congress being the other half, because they were asleep while a blind man was at the wheel driving us to Iraq and ultimately our economic doom. Going to war with Chavez, would be like going to war with Saddam. Nothing good will come of it, and you are left with trying to fix shit afterwards, that does nothing but cost lives and money, to fix nothing. The war in 1982 was more or less each side throwing their weight around, but not much changed afterwards other than people lost lives. Argentinians still claimed that they owned the land after the war, and has been part of their constitution for many years now. All this does is start another conflict like they had before, and not much else will change because of it. Doesnt matter whose flag it flies under at this point, it will always be a sore point for generations to come until people sit down and work out the problem. Look at the Gaza strip and the West Bank. They have been at war since the 40's and 60's over similar issues. The same thing will happen in the Falklands; if people dont wise up, it will be nothing but perpetual war.

Edited by digip
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That island is so far from Argentina it'd be like America claiming Jamaica as its own. Argentina has never had a valid historcal claim on that island. Its a bullshit claim they bring up when their government comes under too much pressure from the people. Get that patriotic fury going and the the Argentinian people will forget what about their government, or atleast their politicians hope so. Same bullshit we see governments do the world over.

Who cares if its about oil. It is a tiny hunk of rock in the Atlantic, and its not like Argentina can exactly use an indigenous rights claim considering what they did to the indigenous people of Argentina.

A war was fought, Argentina lost. If tehy want the island back then I say go to war, because they have no legitimate claim to it otherwards. Its British land, and if they want to develop its natural resources, then they have a right to, and a right to reep 100% of its profits. THats my .02 anyways. Not to mention the inhabitants clearly want to remain British.

I'll go so far as to disagree with the other Americans here. If an armed conflict does arise, I'd be for the US backing the UK militarily. The world sucks and you're only as strong as your friendships. That being said, theres no real reason there should be a war over this. This has diplomatic solution written all over it. Plus, Argentina can't afford a war, let alone actually win one.

Edited by Kyle 2.0
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Hugo Chávez is the president of Venezuela...

Thats another valid point. What say does he have in what Argentina does? Thats a rhetorical question by the way....

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  • 3 weeks later...

Well... He needs cash and this is the way to put it.

Can I just say, hats off to Vako. Very good response and has helped me a lot. I actually think it was bloody brilliant. I won't put my true thoughts in there, but anyway.

Umm yeah, also thank you Deags great reply.

Not to say digp wasn't, but I think Vako saw what was going on. Your reply was very much appreciated.

But yeah, take this for what it is.

Oh and as a person, I am from Britain, but I'm more a lover of culture. So I struggle with putting an argument across myself, anyway I doubt anyone read this so thanks. I truly mean this, thank you.

Edited by cabster21
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