VaKo Posted June 27, 2009 Share Posted June 27, 2009 But this is the perfect time for the next wave to start-ups to get funding they need to develop and mass produce the technology required to reduce emissions. This is how a free market works, where there is a need for something, people step in and provide what is needed, in return for money. The money needs to be spent either way, and I would prefer that it was spent on cleaner more efficient technology rather than propping up old crap technology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_s Posted June 27, 2009 Author Share Posted June 27, 2009 Your induction loops would wear out and what if there is a power outage or the induction power lines got worn out, they would have to dig up the round to fix them, also they would have to put them under a decent amount of concrete (to prevent wear) and wouldn't the concrete prevent as much power transfer, also what about old perfectly good cars, their owners would have to get new ones (what if they can not afford them, sol??). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaKo Posted June 27, 2009 Share Posted June 27, 2009 Well you design the roads to make it easy to swap out dead parts, you don't just concrete the things in and be forced to dig them up every time you need to do a firmware upgrade. As for older cars, eventually they will need to be replaced anyway, but with every old technology the support costs increase dramatically once it reaches EOL. We're not talking about digging up all the roads tomorrow, installing induction loops and forcing everyone to buy new cars, we're talking about phasing in better technology to replace the stuff we're having problems with now. As I've said, I can only see the idea of induction loops in the roads being used in large cities initially, and not for some time yet. So while it is a blue-sky idea now, everything you own started off with someone going "hey, wouldn't it be cool if we could do this?". You cannot just think in terms on 10 years or so, we need to think in terms of 50-100 years down the line and lay the groundwork for our grandkids to get rich building the stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
still learning Posted June 27, 2009 Share Posted June 27, 2009 The switch to better gas effecient vehicles will be good all around. For the earth, for the people, peoples pockets, plus it will create alot of jobs for people. The way its working now, is not working very well. We should not have to depend on other countries for oil or energy. All of our old gas cars we can sell to another country like Cuba or somebody. hehe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seshan Posted June 27, 2009 Share Posted June 27, 2009 Your induction loops would wear out and what if there is a power outage or the induction power lines got worn out, they would have to dig up the round to fix them, also they would have to put them under a decent amount of concrete (to prevent wear) and wouldn't the concrete prevent as much power transfer, also what about old perfectly good cars, their owners would have to get new ones (what if they can not afford them, sol??). Dude, you don't really think do you? It's not like they are going to be like BAM and the next day your gas cars don't work. It would be worked in over time. It would be completely stupid to cover them with concrete. They could have it so cars follow them and their wheels going on either side of it. Less wear. This could be built with automated systems so there would be no need for a human driver when they are on this system. This would also stop the traffic problems we have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_s Posted June 27, 2009 Author Share Posted June 27, 2009 Seshan my whole point was that if they kept the road system we have and tried to integrate it there would be problems, and if we overhauled the current working system because of a false belief in the bull shit that is global warming (read some of the quotes, I believe Zimmer has in his sig) it shows people who thought we would freeze to death by NOW!!! Now it is the reverse where going to die of heatstroke, it is bull shit, so takes you head out of the sand and actually relize that your feel good because you think your helping the environment attitude is bull shit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssmithisme Posted June 27, 2009 Share Posted June 27, 2009 Seshan my whole point was that if they kept the road system we have and tried to integrate it there would be problems, and if we overhauled the current working system because of a false belief in the bull shit that is global warming (read some of the quotes, I believe Zimmer has in his sig) it shows people who thought we would freeze to death by NOW!!! Now it is the reverse where going to die of heatstroke, it is bull shit, so takes you head out of the sand and actually relize that your feel good because you think your helping the environment attitude is bull shit! I agree, Global Warming is bullshit and Al Gore is a wingnut who thinks he invented the internet. "Go-Green" has become nothing more than a marketing scam. We are an incredibly wasteful society and this needs to be changed. Our resources NEED to be better used. Not for the planet. But for the people. Society would be alot happier if we didnt have this shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_s Posted June 27, 2009 Author Share Posted June 27, 2009 We are an incredibly wasteful society and this needs to be changed. Our resources NEED to be better used. Not for the planet. But for the people. Society would be alot happier if we didnt have this shit. Well Put! Oh and it was never not a marketing ploy it was always bull shit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaKo Posted June 27, 2009 Share Posted June 27, 2009 The thing is that it is a fact that we are fucking up our planet, look at the example of fish. We got so good at catching them and caught so many that we are in real danger of wiping out whole tranches of top predators, which is why jelly fish are becoming more numerous. When it comes to forests, we're expanding further and further into virgin territory, cutting down the tree's and replacing them with farm land. Which then due to the nature of modern farm land rapidly becomes un-viable for food production, so we build more houses on it and cut yet more tree's down. The amount of pollutants we're releasing/dumping into the air, water and land is having an effect on the climate. You cannot have a civilization at the level ours is at and not have it impact on the climate of the planet. We can use technology to keep things going for longer but eventually something will give. Zimmers quotes are bullshit because he hasn't provided context for any of them, if he wants to debate them why not provide the full texts, with context and not a selection of badly edited highlights used to drive a biased agenda. Bottom line, humans are impacting the climate of the planet, we just don't know exactly how and where the real damage is being done. What is clear is that burning a shit load of fossil fuels, dumping pollutants and turning every last bit of land into either farm land or concrete is causing us problems. If we don't stop these problems will turn into catastro-fucks that will cause wars, and eventually lead to a large chunk of the human race being killed off. Personally I'd rather pay a little more tax than wind up in a shotgun fight over a clean source of water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h3%5kr3w Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 ... ok then everyone. It's settled, put me on a shuttle slated to land on an alternate planet, with my 2009 Camero and AMD quadcore with a 1200 watt power supply, and I'll leave you all alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimmer Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Zimmers quotes are bullshit because he hasn't provided context for any of them, if he wants to debate them why not provide the full texts, with context and not a selection of badly edited highlights used to drive a biased agenda. Um those quotes where just to point out that thirty years ago many many people thought we where going to die of global cooling but now we are fine and the great concern is that we will die of heatstroke. Oh and for drive a biased agenda I am trying to drive a agenda, I don't believe it is biased, my agenda is to show that this is a cycle of bullshit it goes from cooling to warming to what endlessly. I can't see why I would be biased, oh I know, I AM BIASED TO NOT WASTING MY MONEY ON BULL SHIT!! Oh and here is a good book, maybe your not so far brainwashed yet :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h3%5kr3w Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 ya know... I am sorry about my posts. I let my head get above my you-know-what. You are all cool people, and though I know this is a debate, I got a little out of hand, and for that I am sorry. I am happy for anything that is good for the people, but my bottom line is that everything lately that is for the 'good' of everyone is something you have to pay more than usual for, and in the economy as of right now or the future, this is not good for us unless we do not have to pay extra for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssmithisme Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Everything we need is natural, From cures to diseases to the way we build our homes. There is too much man made materials. We need to properly harvest the land and use what we have. You may find a perfect example of what I mean if you look back in time before the world was fucked. Native Americans harvested the land and didnt waste a thing. I have many beleifs on how things should be done one thing being, my save the tree's argument usually goes something like , instead of wood and cotton..etc we can use Hemp. Hemp is stronger, cheaper and can be grown in great abundance. And it has many many uses. Cannabis Sativa literally translated mean "useful hemp" If you use resources correctly the earth has a balance which will stay. [EDIT] Also, I am a firm believer that temperature changes are a natural occurrence. There have been cold periods in time, and there have been warm periods. Its the way the poles move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
still learning Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Um those quotes where just to point out that thirty years ago many many people thought we where going to die of global cooling but now we are fine and the great concern is that we will die of heatstroke. Oh and for I am trying to drive a agenda, I don't believe it is biased, my agenda is to show that this is a cycle of bullshit it goes from cooling to warming to what endlessly. I can't see why I would be biased, oh I know, I AM BIASED TO NOT WASTING MY MONEY ON BULL SHIT!! Oh and here is a good book, maybe your not so far brainwashed yet :) You are so full of shit. What kind of summer are you having, one in NY or Canada? If you lived in the South you would feel the heat for yourself. Come feel the FL heat for yourself, you will probuly get an ass kicking because you sound like a pussy. All of that global warming shit is real, anyone in south FL knows that. Esp. West Palm Beach area. It turns 1 degree hotter every year during summer. That would probuly make the condition where you are at nicer and more comfy up north. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaKo Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11462 Read this Zimmer, and get back to me. The thing with science is to remember that if the information changes, the outcomes change. Science is also very complicated, and you have to read a lot before things make sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimmer Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Wow still learning so very constructive ;) Oh Vako thanks for the link will read. Vako the book I linked to, gave a good fact... IN the medieval ages the heat was above what we have now, yet it was a golden age for intellectual thinking (this is NOT the dark age) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaKo Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Where was it a golden age? The world is a big place... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimmer Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Vako Europe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_s Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Vako I don't see how you can believe that global warming is real do honestly believe that the world stays at one temperature forever, (so what summer is global warming temperature goes from 30 to 90 in less than A YEAR!!!). Vako there are ice ages and so there will be time that there will be warm ages, it is natural! Oh and the link you gave Zimmer it was published 17:00 16 May 2007 by Michael Le Page (2 Years ago) The thing with science is to remember that if the information changes, the outcomes change. Science is also very complicated, and you have to read a lot before things make sense. So you have stated that science changes fast, yet you point to articles from two years ago! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nullArray Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 k........., so I've read this whole thing and I think a lot of you guys have no idea what you're talking about in terms of basic science concepts and ideas and even less about macroeconomics of the entire world. Citing your own uneducated ideas as absolute truth and fact..., is completely wrong. Here's what I think. Of course, anecdotal..., these were the primary reasons behind the bill: 1. With mostly everything moved to wind/solar/geothermal, all our electricity would be domestic, and the jobs domestic too. Saving,............................, insane amounts of money/jobs that goes to other countries. 2. No one is forced to do anything. If you want a massive car, you can still get it...., just be ready to pay more for it. 3. I don't understand it when people poo poo fundamental earth saving principles. Even if you don't believe in global warming (climate change is more appropriate, it doesn't get warmer everywhere), you can't support jobs/money staying in the US, cleaner air, more produce, more fish, more animals, cleaner water, maintained and beautiful forests and natural landscapes, etc etc etc. It's mindboggling. The reason companies hate this stuff is because they have to spend a bit more money to properly dispose of waste products and the like. 4. You'll save money too..., but not right away. You'll probably pay less for cars, be able to drive them further, and recharge/fill them for less. 5. Your kids kids will thank you. ------------------ It seems like you guys have been watching too much Fox News..., they spread fake controversy everywhere. Last, your induction road thing? Gosh, it's stupid that that was even brought up. We don't even have paved roads or internet everywhere. Priorities people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nullArray Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Vako I don't see how you can believe that global warming is real do honestly believe that the world stays at one temperature forever, (so what summer is global warming temperature goes from 30 to 90 in less than A YEAR!!!). Vako there are ice ages and so there will be time that there will be warm ages, it is natural! Oh and the link you gave Zimmer it was published 17:00 16 May 2007 by Michael Le Page (2 Years ago) So you have stated that science changes fast, yet you point to articles from two years ago! Okay, I'll bite. Global warming isn't real. You are clearly a scientist and have done plenty of research. Let's continue on our path of massive pollution because there are NO consequences at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_s Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Null Array good points but... 1. What about off shore drilling, it is domestic, so it isn't just for domestics it is for bull shit (what I have a problem with), I am fine with environment helping as long as it isn't for bull shit agendas and (see two) 2. Pay more, why? to please a bunch of people who believe in global warming? 3 Ok fine, but that extra to dispose of stuff (to please people who believe in bull shit) is passed on to the consumer, right that is great, I pay more to please bull shit. 4 I like saving money but this only changes where you save money and only if you fit a criteria (seems to be global goodness), also the green vehicles will be smaller and less powerful, for hauling companies and construction etc (things where power is needed) they will pay more and it will trickle down to the consumer (I am again paying more).. 5. Ya ok no complaints here So all the extra cost to both consumer and to well consumer will add up and the bottom line will be are cost to live will rise NOT lower. Was the last part sarcasm or not?? ----------- Other post I am not a scientist, I just see bull shit in this well bull shit that is global warming. Oh too much Fox News, um no more like way too much CNN, it might as well stand for Clinton New Network, CNN is just a bunch of democrats bashing republicans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimmer Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Vako I have been checking out the website a little more sense bob_s posted about the dates and there is nothing critical or global warming it seems it is just a biased agenda driven based website for global warming Your words put it best used to drive a biased agenda. so stop complaining that I have a biased agenda (saving money, horable I know) and then give me a link that is biased (IMO more than me I am fine with improving resource usage etc as long as it follows logical points not pushed by a bunch of bull shit). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nullArray Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Null Array good points but... 1. What about off shore drilling, it is domestic, so it isn't just for domestics it is for bull shit (what I have a problem with), I am fine with environment helping as long as it isn't for bull shit agendas and (see two) 2. Pay more, why? to please a bunch of people who believe in global warming? 3 Ok fine, but that extra to dispose of stuff (to please people who believe in bull shit) is passed on to the consumer, right that is great, I pay more to please bull shit. 4 I like saving money but this only changes where you save money and only if you fit a criteria (seems to be global goodness), also the green vehicles will be smaller and less powerful, for hauling companies and construction etc (things where power is needed) they will pay more and it will trickle down to the consumer (I am again paying more).. 5. Ya ok no complaints here So all the extra cost to both consumer and to well consumer will add up and the bottom line will be are cost to live will rise NOT lower. Was the last part sarcasm or not?? ----------- Other post I am not a scientist, I just see bull shit in this well bull shit that is global warming. Oh too much Fox News, um no more like way too much CNN, it might as well stand for Clinton New Network, CNN is just a bunch of democrats bashing republicans. omigosh! YOU'RE TOTALLY RIGHT! Offshore drilling, BEAUTIFUL! All those companies that will be doing it are AMERICAN. Right!? (nope) Oh yeah, fuck those TINY CARS. AMERICAN'S DRIVE HUGE CARS! Duh..., OF COURSE, those faggot democrats are going to make construction companies, truckers, and AMERICAN farmers drive those faggot battery powered two person cars. How will will they get work done?! (Don't be so naive) =============================================================== I'm done,... I'm arguing on a forum with something that's 100% anonymous who created this thread to spark controversy. Did you honestly think that everyone here would buckle down and agree with you? You aren't a scientist, you aren't an economist, you aren't a politician. Hell for all I know (and can only assume) you're probably under 18. You have massive conceited selfish ideals that are ridiculously one sided. Some of us here are just trying to balance you out..., no one can have it all. In the end..., we have an administration and congress that support notions you don't. It's going to change, and there's nothing you can do about it. Sorry kiddo. Even if things get worlds better, you'll probably still be all grumpy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_s Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Oops just realized it was directed at Zimmer DOH :) Offshore drilling, BEAUTIFUL! All those companies that will be doing it are AMERICAN. Right!? (nope) But some will which is more than we have now Oh yeah, fuck those TINY CARS. AMERICAN'S DRIVE HUGE CARS! Duh..., OF COURSE, those faggot democrats are going to make construction companies, truckers, and AMERICAN farmers drive those faggot battery powered two person cars. How will will they get work done?! (Don't be so naive) I am just pointing out that the ideology that everyone can use small cars and America is just egotistically for using big cars is wrong (Some are egotistical), some people need cars that are more powerful and they will cost more causing products to cost more that isn't good. You are the one who blow it out into small cars are evil! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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